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    What do you do...

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    Arik
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    What do you do...

    Post  Arik on Thu May 03, 2012 10:21 am

    There are times when you may run across a person who is Jewish by birth but has had no Jewish education, knows little about Torah and has been raised to be xtian. The Talmud teaches we shouldn't debate Jewish "heretics" because it may only push them deeper into their folly, on the other hand, it seems hard to let go of these poor souls who may have been heavily indoctrinated over the years by people who may not know any better. Yet we are allowed to get into debates with gentiles? It seems kinda strange to me. I think it is tragic when you run across some Jewish people who haven't had the Torah education to teach them to value G-d and Torah without intermediaries ( jsus, bddhism, new age, etc.,)


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    juggy4711

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    Re: What do you do...

    Post  juggy4711 on Sun May 20, 2012 5:29 pm

    Interesting. I wasn't aware of that. It does seem odd. If one never received the proper education are they by definition a heretic or are the just ignorant? Seems like heretic would mean the rejection of Torah not the ignorance of it? Which brings the question what is the definition of heretic in context to Judaism?
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    Yehudah

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    Re: What do you do...

    Post  Yehudah on Sun May 20, 2012 6:06 pm

    An Am Aretz is someone who knows nothing about Torah (a Jew). And a heretic is someone who changes just one LETTER of Torah.



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    juggy4711

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    Re: What do you do...

    Post  juggy4711 on Sun May 20, 2012 9:17 pm

    So then a Jew that was an Am Aretz would not be a heretic and there fore would not fall under the scenario Arik proposed?
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    Yehudah

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    Re: What do you do...

    Post  Yehudah on Tue May 29, 2012 1:59 pm

    An am haretz could be a heretic... or they could just be too simple to understand or desire to understand Torah.


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    juggy4711

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    Re: What do you do...

    Post  juggy4711 on Tue May 29, 2012 9:57 pm

    So would it be acceptable to debate and try to educate an am haretz that was not a heretic?
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    Arik
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    Re: What do you do...

    Post  Arik on Wed May 30, 2012 9:04 am

    juggy4711 wrote:So would it be acceptable to debate and try to educate an am haretz that was not a heretic?

    "Go from the presence of the foolish man when you perceive not in him the lips of knowledge"

    That is from the Proverbs.
    Basically don;t waste your time arguing with an ignoramus. You may have come to that conclusion watching me debate with people on GTRI. More often than not, it does no good and only makes the ignorant dig their heels in deeper.
    If someone truly wants to learn, they will usually ask and are smart enough to know to learn from someone who is more learned than they are and they are not to proud to accept that their are some who are more knowledgeable than they are.


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    Yehudah

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    Re: What do you do...

    Post  Yehudah on Wed May 30, 2012 10:58 am

    Look, if someone wants to actually have a two-way conversation, I'm game. But if it's clear that the conversation is one-way (his/her way), then I won't bother.


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