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    Questions of Time?

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    juggy4711

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    Questions of Time?

    Post  juggy4711 on Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:40 am

    How old do y'all believe the Universe is?

    What time frame do these cover?

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    Arik
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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  Arik on Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:54 pm

    For one thing, time is relative. Also, there is nothing in the Bible that actually says "the universe is (fill in the blank) years old"


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    juggy4711

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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  juggy4711 on Mon Sep 05, 2011 8:55 pm

    Arik wrote:For one thing, time is relative. Also, there is nothing in the Bible that actually says "the universe is (fill in the blank) years old"

    I'm know time is relative but isn't there some guess or consensus about these questions? Perhaps not the first but what "relative" time periods cover the later three?
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    Arik
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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  Arik on Tue Sep 06, 2011 10:33 am

    juggy4711 wrote:
    Arik wrote:For one thing, time is relative. Also, there is nothing in the Bible that actually says "the universe is (fill in the blank) years old"

    I'm know time is relative but isn't there some guess or consensus about these questions? Perhaps not the first but what "relative" time periods cover the later three?

    If you are asking for dates between key players in the Hebrew Bible, We have Adam beginning with Year 1,he lived until 930 BCE, the year 1656 was the flood, 1996 BCE the dispurtion. The Era of the Judges ( according to Gaon of Vilna) From Joshua to Samuel between 2480 and 2500 BCE to 2880 BCE, The Monarchy went from 2880 The division of the Kingdom,2964, the exile of the 10 tribes 3205 BCE, the destruction of the Temple 3338 BCE. The Babylonian exile 3310 to 3440 BCE.


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    juggy4711

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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  juggy4711 on Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:01 pm

    Arik wrote:
    juggy4711 wrote:
    Arik wrote:For one thing, time is relative. Also, there is nothing in the Bible that actually says "the universe is (fill in the blank) years old"

    I'm know time is relative but isn't there some guess or consensus about these questions? Perhaps not the first but what "relative" time periods cover the later three?

    If you are asking for dates between key players in the Hebrew Bible, We have Adam beginning with Year 1,he lived until 930 BCE, the year 1656 was the flood, 1996 BCE the dispurtion. The Era of the Judges ( according to Gaon of Vilna) From Joshua to Samuel between 2480 and 2500 BCE to 2880 BCE, The Monarchy went from 2880 The division of the Kingdom,2964, the exile of the 10 tribes 3205 BCE, the destruction of the Temple 3338 BCE. The Babylonian exile 3310 to 3440 BCE.

    Adam lived until 930 BCE, 726 years after the flood?
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    Arik
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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  Arik on Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:14 pm

    Huh? The flood came 1656 years AFTER Adam


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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  juggy4711 on Mon Oct 10, 2011 2:47 am

    Arik wrote:Huh? The flood came 1656 years AFTER Adam

    Man unless they changed BC/AD more than just BCE/CE, 930BCE is 726 years after 1656 BCE. BCE count down to zero just like BC. CE count up just like AD. Least that is the way I learned it. scratch
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    Arik
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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  Arik on Mon Oct 10, 2011 9:40 am

    In Jewish tradition. Adam the First was created...This is year ONE...."from creation" i.e. from the creation of Adam..


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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  juggy4711 on Mon Dec 26, 2011 8:26 pm

    Arik wrote:In Jewish tradition. Adam the First was created...This is year ONE...."from creation" i.e. from the creation of Adam..

    So how long has it been since Adam was created?
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    Yehudah

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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  Yehudah on Tue Dec 27, 2011 8:53 pm

    5772 years.

    There are some machloches in regards to this, and I'll give you a quick synopsis of what the popular versions are, then what I believe:

    -Hashem created the earth old. Our sages say that the earth is 6000+/- years old. Everything appears old because G-d designed it that way.

    -Our time does not sync with G-ds' time. We may see a 24 hour period as one day, while G-ds' 24 hour period could be millions of years.

    -Ramban has concluded that the would is approximately 14.6 billion years old based on his cheshbon.

    I believe all three, and I don't think they bend each other too much. Our observance of time is not G-d's observance of time, He is timeless... thus the world could be 15 billion years old, or 6000 years old.

    The Torah teaches us that G-d created the earth in less than 6 days. My Rebbi, Rabbi Chaim Silver shlita, teaches that the earth was created old, and is only 6000 years old - and the Torah does not contradict this, actually supports it. The midrashim supports it as well. But there are other Rabbaim who are on much higher madregos that believe like Ramban.

    There you have it.


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    juggy4711

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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  juggy4711 on Tue Dec 27, 2011 11:57 pm

    Yehudah wrote:5772 years.

    There are some machloches in regards to this, and I'll give you a quick synopsis of what the popular versions are, then what I believe:

    -Hashem created the earth old. Our sages say that the earth is 6000+/- years old. Everything appears old because G-d designed it that way.

    -Our time does not sync with G-ds' time. We may see a 24 hour period as one day, while G-ds' 24 hour period could be millions of years.

    -Ramban has concluded that the would is approximately 14.6 billion years old based on his cheshbon.

    I believe all three, and I don't think they bend each other too much. Our observance of time is not G-d's observance of time, He is timeless... thus the world could be 15 billion years old, or 6000 years old.

    The Torah teaches us that G-d created the earth in less than 6 days. My Rebbi, Rabbi Chaim Silver shlita, teaches that the earth was created old, and is only 6000 years old - and the Torah does not contradict this, actually supports it. The midrashim supports it as well. But there are other Rabbaim who are on much higher madregos that believe like Ramban.

    There you have it.

    Ugh one thing I have found discouraging here is the constant usage of Jewish terms when it seems unnecessary. Unless there is some reason one is religiously required to use those terms I find it cumbersome. I don't really want to google every term I am unfamiliar with. If at all possible could y'all include the closest possible English translation of those terms when used?
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    Yehudah

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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  Yehudah on Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:09 pm

    Sorry... it's actually how I talk.

    I'll try and parenthetically translate as I go.


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    Yehudah

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    Re: Questions of Time?

    Post  Yehudah on Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:11 pm

    machloches = arguement
    cheshbon = calculation
    shlita = he should live and be well
    midrashim = midrash in plural
    madregos = level of holiness


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